Space & Astronomy/Space and Astronomy (October 1993).iso/mac/TEXT/SPACEDIG/V13_5/V13_559.TXT

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Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #559

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 13 : Issue 559

Today's Topics:
           Re: Advancing Launch Technology
              Re: SPACE Digest V13 #517
             Toward 2001 - 13 May
            Press kits/ STS FAQ/ Thank you
               Locating Cape Canaveral
             Re: 2001 and "The Endeavor"
              Re: Why the space station?
               Re: Saturn V and the ALS
              Re: Honking at cyclists...
              Re: Honking at cyclists...

Administrivia:

    Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to
  [e-mail].  Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests,
  should be sent to [e-mail], or, if urgent, to
             [e-mail]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 15 May 91 02:09:55 GMT
From: agate!lightning.Berkeley.EDU![e-mail]  (Frank Crary)
Subject: Re: Advancing Launch Technology

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Fraering Philip) writes:
>1. Assembly in space may be a lot cheaper and easier than you think.
>Since the Russians can do it with their rather less developed automation,
>shouldn't it be easier with the more developed technology here?
>
Be carefull what you mean when you say "assembly." The Soviet on-orbit
assembly work has involved docking pre-fabricated modules together. They
have found this to be reasonably simple. They have also tested tools and
procedures to "assemble" things on orbit. These include unfolding
gird-work structures, welding, bolting things together, etc... They have
found this sort of work to be quite dificult, though not impossible.
On-orbit assembly of, for example, a Mars sample return, might easily
involve a significant amount of construction work, rather than just
docking two modules together.

                                     Frank Crary
                     UC Berkeley

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 15:43:44 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!news.cs.indiana.edu!maytag!watmath!watdragon!watyew![e-mail]  (James Davis Nicoll)
Subject: Re: SPACE Digest V13 #517

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Fraering Philip) writes:
>Re: my comments about terraforming one of Jupiter's satellites:
>
>Can't any of you guys see the humor in a post without the smiley
>for once?

    Certainly. See my brief monograph 'Humour Detection in the absence
of Humour Notation Symbols, in Electronic Media'. I think the section on
sci.space is in volume eight.

                                James Nicoll

------------------------------

Date: 11 May 91 18:50:20 GMT
From: dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!caen!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.pitt.edu!pitt!nss![e-mail]  (Bev Freed)
Subject: Toward 2001 - 13 May


                            ***********
                            TOWARD 2001
                            ***********
                       Week of 13 May 1991
                 A Weekly Feature of SPACE CALENDAR
                   + = Domestic (USA) Earth event
                   * = Domestic (USA) space event
                   o = International Earth event
                   # = International space event
--------------------------------------------------------------------
                        REPRINT INFORMATION
This information is reproduced by permission of the Space Age
Publishing Company.  All rights reserved.  Copyright May 13,
1991.  Reproduction in any form without written permission violates
federal statute with penalty of up to $50,000.  SPACE CALENDAR is
edited and published on the Big `Space' Island of Hawaii.
====================================================================
                           * * * * * * *
+ Space Station Cost
Washington DC

The General Accounting Office estimates that over a 30 year
lifetime, Space Station Freedom will cost $118 billion to maintain,
supply, and operate. Comptroller General Charles Bowsher corrected
NASA's construction estimates for the reduced station upward to $40
billion.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Satellite Network Systems Inc
St Paul MN

A major study by SNS reveals "a strong need for greater satellite
capacity and simplified operating procedures" in Europe, according
to president and CEO Paul Heinerscheid. The study is based on
extensive interviews of private broadcasters and regulatory
officials in Europe.
                           * * * * * * *
o Global Satellite Communications
Nanjing, China

The China Institute of Communications and Intelsat together will
sponsor a symposium `Global Satellite Communications' on 28-31 May
1991 in Nanjing. More than 30 sessions will focus on new
technologies and ideas, and on financial, legal, and cultural
issues.
                           * * * * * * *
o Dornier / ERS-1
Friedrichshafen, Germany

ERS-1, which should be in orbit if an early May launch was on time
and successful, results from a consortium of 50 companies from 14
nations, coordinated under prime contractor Dornier GmbH. More than
3,000 engineers worked on the project over a 10 year period.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Spaceport Florida
Cocoa Beach FL

A bill recently passed by the state legislature will give the
Spaceport Florida Authority greater latitude in selling bonds to pay
for projects involving private businesses and to join with state
universities to build space research and launch facilities.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Delta Launch Complex 2 Changes
Vandenberg AFB CA

McDonnell Douglas personnel are raising the service tower 12 feet
and installing a larger RP-1 fuel tank to allow the complex to
accommodate the Delta II rocket. The upgraded Delta will be used to
launch NASA's Polar satellite in mid-1993.
                           * * * * * * *
+ UAH / USSR Tour
Huntsville AL / Moscow USSR

The University of Alabama in Huntsville is sponsoring "Soviet
Aerospace Trip: A Business and Cultural Experience" for two-weeks,
beginning on 6 September 1991. UAH will arrange for meetings between
participants and their Soviet counterparts.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Dept of Energy / SEI
Washington DC

A recent Washington Post article by Kathy Sawyer points out that the
DOE is requesting $142 million for Space Exploration Initiative
research while NASA is only requesting $94 million.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Milky Way Radio Emissions
Albuquerque NM

Astronomers are puzzled by a source of radio waves that vary greatly
over short periods -- a highly unusual cosmic event. The source was
discovered on 11 March by Jun-Hui Zhao, a Beijing astronomer
conducting studies at New Mexico's Very Large Array telescope.
                           * * * * * * *
+ Lunar Footnote (Statistic)

6,724 Days Since Moon last visited by humans.
                           * * * * * * *
o International Space Year 1992 (Quotation)

      "The most important policy objective of the ISY . . . is
  to instill a new Space Age frame of reference in the thoughts and
               actions of governments and individuals."
                  -- The late U S Senator Spark M Matsunaga, Hawaii
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====================================================================


--- Opus-CBCS 1.14
 * Origin: NSS BBS - Ad Astra! [phone] *HST* (1:129/104.0)
--
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INTERNET: [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 21:43:45 GMT
From: agate!stanford.edu!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!usc!samsung!spool.mu.edu!munnari.oz.au!comp.vuw.ac.nz!waikato.ac.nz![e-mail]
Subject: Press kits/ STS FAQ/ Thank you


    In reply to my inquiry about old press kits I received a few replies
(Thank you). These tended to fall into two categories.
    a) Directions to the /pub/SPACE/PRESS.KITS directory. Available through
anoymous ftp at ames.arc.nasa.gov. There is a good chance I might be able to do
some ftp'ing in a couple of months so I'll get them then. If anyone knows of
other worthwhile ftp sites I'd appreciate some mail. (Maybe a directory list
for /pub/SPACE ?).
    b) Requests for me to forward any press kits I did get. Unfortunately I
am unable to do this as I don't have international mail privledges (as yet :))
hence my putting this here instead of mailing it to the individuals involved.

    Is anyone interested in putting together a FAQ post about shuttle
missions. ie. STS-??, crew, payload, anything else of note? I would be prepared
to do one but do not have enough information currently, or much time (so why am
I on news? :)).

    Finally a note to all contributers to sci.space. I have always been
interested in space matters (I want to be an astronaut dad :)) but growing up
in New Zealand has limited what I can find on the subject (If it wasn't for
this news group I would not have known the shuttle had been launched and/or
Gallileo was in trouble, etc). I have also found that the discussions tend to
remain fresh and interesting, ie. as soon as a yes/no battle begins to stagnate
a new topic apears. So in conclusion, THANK YOU.

------------------------------

Date: 15 May 91 04:08:45 GMT
From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!spool.mu.edu!munnari.oz.au!mel.dit.csiro.au!dmp.csiro.au![e-mail]  (Shane Youl)
Subject: Locating Cape Canaveral

A colleague of mine will soon be in the US and would like to visit Cape
Canaveral. Could someone give me an appropriate postal address and/or
FAX number for contacting NASA about visits to the various installations.

ADVthanksANCE
--
                                         ____   _____     ____    ____
  Shane Youl                            /    \ /       / /    \  /    \
  CSIRO Division of Mineral Products   /      /_____  / /_____/ /     /
  PO Box 124   Port Melbourne  3207   /            / / /   \   /     /

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 03:18:51 GMT
From: snorkelwacker.mit.edu!spool.mu.edu!cs.umn.edu!kksys!wd0gol!newave![e-mail]  (John A. Weeks III)
Subject: Re: 2001 and "The Endeavor"

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Rick Ottolini) writes:
> The introduction of the Endeavor shuttle with the theme music from "2001"
> was bitersweet to me.  When I first saw the movie, a year before the moon
> landing, I thought many of the things in the movie would occur by that time.
> It looks like they won't.

Did you see or read 2010?  Nine years after 2001, the US still hadn't sent
a follow up mission after the loss of contact with Discovery.  And in 2010,
the next US Jupiter mission was still years off, despite having found
something worth checking out.  According to the book, even when NASA had
a clear cut goal to chase, they still wandered around aimlessly.  The more
things change, the more things stay the same....

We (the human race, not just the US) might be a little bit behind the 2001
schedule, but it will happen someday.

-john-

--
=============================================================================
John A. Weeks III               [phone]             [e-mail]
NeWave Communications, Ltd.                        ...uunet!tcnet!newave!john

------------------------------

Date: 15 May 91 00:57:44 GMT
From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!rex!rouge![e-mail]  (Fraering Philip)
Subject: Re: Why the space station?

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Gary Coffman) writes:

>statistical sampling would be an enormous waste. A Soviet style
>land, grab the first thing at hand, and blast off for home is
>hardly of enormous scientific value. You would want a system that
>could rove around and take representative samples from many locations.
>This phase could take months, probably over a year. Then you'd need
>a return craft capable of returning all those samples. We're talking
>lots of mass out and back. Without HLV we must assemble in space or
>forego the mission.

The sort of unmanned/manned sample-return mission a lot of people would
probably like to see would be one which brought back several tens of tons of
core samples from the polar caps. The polar caps may have locked up in them
a record of the climate of Mars over its 4.5 billion year history.

Mars will not be as easy to quantify with an Apollo-style sampling
as the moon was. Anyway, even with HLV, the scale I just described
would have to be assembled in space or the mission foregone.

Even with HLV's, if assembly and on-site resources are not used,
you're just going to repeat Apollo.

--
Phil Fraering || Usenet (?):[e-mail] || YellNet: 318/365-5418
''It hardly mattered now; it was, in fact, a fine and enviable
madness, this delusion that all questions have answers, and nothing is
beyond the reach of a strong left arm.`` - Larry Niven and Jerry
Pournelle, _The Mote in God's Eye_

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 17:53:42 GMT
From: sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!caen!ox.com!hela![e-mail]  (Allen W. Sherzer)
Subject: Re: Saturn V and the ALS

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Henry Spencer) writes:

>I have to side with NASA on this one, I'm afraid.  How long will it take
>to get "cheaper approaches" into production?

Should be doable in five years. We fund HL Delta and Titan V for heavy
lift. We buy a Soyuz or rebuild a simple Apollo CSM to transport crew. To
finish it off, we build a simple space station (perhaps the LLNL plan
of something from the SSI ET study). All of this should be doable for about
one years Shuttle costs. This would give us every capability the Shuttle now
has. It would also be cheaper and allow more work to be done.

   Allen
--
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Allen W. Sherzer |        Allen's tactics are too tricky to deal with      |
|   [e-mail]   |             -- Harel Barzilai                           |
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 22:20:09 GMT
From: snorkelwacker.mit.edu!spool.mu.edu!news.nd.edu!mentor.cc.purdue.edu!noose.ecn.purdue.edu!en.ecn.purdue.edu![e-mail]  (/dev/null)
Subject: Re: Honking at cyclists...

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Craig Levin) writes:
>
>     Excuse me, gentlemen, but perhaps this string ought to be
> conducted in sci.environment or sci.energy?

Well, this discussion is neither about pollution nor energy although
it is certainly a germaine issue in the discussion.  It is about
motivation to space colonization, its economics, etc.

It has gotten a bit off track, but forgive me (& the others) and place
it in a kill file if it continues in the vein you dislike... :) :)

--
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Society of Philosophers, Luminaries,           | Brent L. Irvine       |
| and Other Professional Thinking People.....   | Only my own ramblings |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: 14 May 91 15:35:28 GMT
From: pasteur!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!caen!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watdragon!watyew![e-mail]  (James Davis Nicoll)
Subject: Re: Honking at cyclists...


    Granted, C is the important limit on how fast we could grow (and
I did say at one point 'ignoring C' when I was talking about Eating The
Universe) but all that means is that we run out of resources to continue
our current growth rates sooner rather than later. I was disagreeing with the
thesis 'Human wants will grow unbounded, and so will our use of resources'.

    Anyway, if there are 5x10**9 humans at 50 kg each, and they grow
at 3% a year, and the universe masses 100x10**9 (Number of stars) x 100x10**9
(number of galaxies)x1000 (Fudge factor in case there's *lots* of dark matter)
x 2x10**33 kg (mass of a sol-type star), it still only takes ~3700 years
(Given no speed limit) for the mass of all humans to equal the mass of the
universe. Since we can't ignore the C limit, our rate of increase of demand
will *have* to decrease before AD 5700.

    Note I am *not* saying the standard of living of all humanity couldn't
be indefinitely maintained at a higher level than today. I just saying it
won't grow forever.

    Are we agreeing yet?

                                James Nicoll

------------------------------

End of SPACE Digest V13 #559
*******************